Thanks so much for your comments and replies in the posts. I work in North Africa and have used Camel as a method.

I have two contentions with your premises in critiquing the Camel method.

First, the idea that evangelism is an end unto itself is problematic. The communal nature of evangelism and its immediate followup of discipleship takes place in the context of community in every instance in the book of Acts. (the case of the Ethiopian is the only one where one could argue that a single convert was made–though the likelihood of a court official traveling without a large entourage in the ancient world is impossible). The creation of man in the image of God is communal, that is why the singleness of Adam, his aloneness is “not good”–it fails to reflect the essentially relational unity of the Trinitarian God. Therefore, evangelism devoid of community is contra biblical. Furthermore, evangelism practiced as a discipline apart from a community of believers who are a church or becoming a church (have their own leadership, give, and practice the ordinances) is unbiblical in that it does not birth believers into this God intended community. The Great Commission is not a command to evangelize but to make disciples–itself at relational term implying a disciple and a mentor (Matt 28:18ff).

Secondly, the primary use I have found for Camel method and other similar methods is one in which the missiological principles of Luke 9 and Luke 10 of finding the “man of peace” are used. Paul at Mars Hill (Acts 17) used a similar method of starting with pagan authorities of Greek poets (who advocated things completely contrary to a biblical worldview) to give credence to what he said to the philosophers. He ends with the resurrection and is laughed out of the room, but he accomplished his end in that several including Dionysius along with several others believes. Are we saying that Paul advocated everything the poet Pindar said by quoting him to bolster his argument for a creator God? I think not. The Camel Method is similar in this respect. It recognizes that the grace of God allows for portions of truth to be preserved in cultures that are pagan. It is these portions of the truth that allow the missionary to build bridges to the gospel. Those that the Holy Spirit is calling will then respond as Persons of Peace. It is these people who open the door for each town, city, or people group to be reached with the Gospel.

The Camel Method is essentially a pre-evangelism method, like Paul’s Mars Hill speech, that allows us, in our human finite way, to discern who the Holy Spirit is calling to faith in Jesus Christ. Those that the Holy Spirit calls will later, by that same Holy Spirit, be able to recognize the false teachings of the rest of the Koran. The guardian of true doctrine is not the theologian, but God himself. I think that if you read further in Greeson’s book and look at the church planting material used in South Asia by Baptists, you will find that it establishes the principle of Sola Scriptura within the first two lessons after conversion.

Thanks for bringing up these issues and I hope this brings clarification.

M.- I feel limited use of tHe quran is problematic…If you start with, “the Quran states…” then you have given divine authority to a book to which it is not due…an alternative to substantiating the Quran is, “many Muslims believe…” or (preferred) “Do you believe that the Injil is divine as written?…..Can Allah be so weak as to allow His word to be corrupted?” This approach confronts one presuppositions w/o sacrificing your position on the Q’ran….FTR I use this same presuppositional approach w/ mormons, Jews (re:talmud) and other groups w/ ’sacred books

Abu daub-Is correct–but we must discern truth… and not give truth credit where it is undeserving…

Travis- Regarding the name of Allah, What should Arab Christians call the Most High? God (English)? We call Him by what we know Him as according to Scripture. Yet Scripture has been translated so we understand. So for the Arab, to use the Arab word for God, what word is there? Only “Allah”, is the concept of the One, True,
High, and Holy God. Dios-Spanish, God-English, Gott-German, Dei-Latin… Allah-Arab.

True, The God of Mohammed is not the God of Paul. But when the Muslim says, “I follow the God of Adam, Abraham, Isaac, Moses, and Jesus.” Should we say, “No you don’t!”? I submit rather we should strive to help to Muslim know the God he desires. Perhaps, we should seek to correct misconceptions of the One True God…

Greetings from the Middle East. Let me suggest an answer with two quotations:

All truth is God’s truth (St Ambrose I think)

Even the devil is God’s devil (Martin Luther)

Sincerely,

Abu Daoud

As you certainly know Muslims often claim the Bible is not accurate.

What are your thoughts about pointing out to a Muslim that the Qu’ran encourages Muslims to revere and read the Holy Books (Torah and Injeel), that it never states that either are “corrupted” (a later Islamic teaching) and that the study of biblical manuscripts shows that copies of the Holy Books exist today that are even older than the date of Mohammad’s words in the Qu’ran?

The idea being to point out that 1) Mohammad said Muslims should read the Bible, 2) copies of the Bible exist today that were around when Mohammad was alive–which shows that the Bible has not been corrupted since then, and 3) to claim that the Bible is corrupted is to claim that Mohammad either a) encouraged Muslims to read lies or b) was ignorant of the corruption. Of course, no Muslim is likely to admit either.

The whole point is to get them to question the later Islamic teaching of Biblical corruption so that you an get down to the business of reading/teaching scripture with them. The situation is somewhat similar to that faced when witnessing to Jehovah’s Witnesses with their own Bible “translation.”

The issue is whether even this limited use of the Qu’ran is problematic?

I appreciate your thoughts.

Hang tough – the battle is not over – yet! Aslan in on the move!

I’m speechless . . . I have experienced exactly what you have been through.

I pray that you, Chrissi, and Abigail Ruth and are doing well.

Please email me your new phone number and contact information.

I hope Dr. Nettles likes the picture that you sent him!

chadwick

“I think you make it unclear by not adding the point he makes in his book which is that the Camel is not designed to bring faith in Christ, rather to open doors and rapport with a Muslim to then use the Bible to reach Muslims for Christ.”

Actually according to Greeson, after he states “…Reaching Muslims for Christ is NOT the ultimate goal…” (very problematic in itself) he then states “The goal of the [Camel]… is nothing short of training YOU to be a facilitator of a massive church planting movement among the Muslims in your community” (emphasis added) PP ii

Then on page 51 he States “It is critical you understand the purpose and goal of the Camel Method. It is NOT to lead a Muslim to salvation in Christ. Its purpose is to out a PERSON OF PEACE” (emphasis original- not added)

As stated in my original post- the concept of the Camel is Biblical, but yes it falls short in practice both Theologically and Practically—

1. Theologically-by using this approach (which greeson apparently has three different “ultimate” goals with) the evangelist ‘admits’ truth authority in the Quran (by using it). This leads to the practically issue…

2. Practically there are a majority of MBB’s who put great stock in the Quran for guidance and do so because a (M.) did so in the initial gospel presentation. It’s falls short in practice not because its a bad idea but it unintentially plants syncrestic seed

[By the way the strength behind this statement comes not from my 5 years working with Muslims stateside and internationally but primarily from Phil Parshall, Steve Masood, and Warren Larson-all of whom confirmed the 'shortcomings in practice' first hand]

My “distaste”, is not based on misunderstanding, but a clear understanding that this mixed signal approach has yielded at best confused MBB’s and at worst syncrestism in many cases.

Thank you for your service to our Lord, I pray our exchange has challenged your mind as it has mine. I will pray for you during your internship. Be Biblical in theology but also in practice- In Him, Matt

understanding of the Camel method and what it is and is not designed to do.